Re: CEF speed contest Design Discussions

OVERLORD Fri Dec 13, 2013 1:01 pm

You're right Jim, much easier with the same results. Didn't think that far. Thanks

roddie Fri Dec 13, 2013 4:04 pm

OVERLORD wrote:You're right Jim, much easier with the same results. Didn't think that far. Thanks

If you can get your hands on a "laminate trimmer" (a smaller type hand-held router) you could set a straight-bit to a depth; the thickness of your plywood inserts and "rout-out" the holes to proper depth, without having to deal with finish issues on the top-side. Depending on the tool dia.; you'll need to radius the corners on the ply-inserts... but that's no big deal.

"Either way"...one of those ply-panels is for a bell-crank mount... Right? You'll need to counter-bore through the "top-side" (balsa)...down to the plywood; (recessed) for the firm mounting of a machine-screw. If the other two plywood panels are to support gear-legs with any kind of hardware.. they will require the same procedure. Maybe you already have this in mind... Once everything is mounted, then you merely fill the holes on the wing's topside prior to finishing.

Roddie

GUS THE I.A. Sat Dec 14, 2013 2:03 am

Okay... You guys are toast! Here is the winner! When finished, it will be my interpretation of N590PM, a Beechcraft Bonanza that was actually raced in cross-country events. I have worked on the actual plane, and it is a BEAUTY! My model spans 16", and checks out to 48 square inches of wing area. I even incorporated the trike landing gear, to preserve authenticity! The full-scale plane's pictures can be seen on the internet by typing the "N" number into the bar at the top. See why this one will not be purple? It's just too pretty, the way it is, to subject it to my purple influence! Here's mine-before paint... CEF speed contest Design Discussions - Page 13 100_1412

CEF speed contest Design Discussions - Page 13 100_1412

CEF speed contest Design Discussions - Page 13 100_1413

CEF speed contest Design Discussions - Page 13 100_1414

**Cribbs74** Sat Dec 14, 2013 9:19 am

Bonanza annihilation!

Look out Doug! I'll be gunning for you...

Good job on the build, you sure do work quick!

roddie Sat Dec 14, 2013 11:24 am

That's Bonanza's TOO COOL!!! and with that trike gear; you're probably the only one of us that wont be breaking props on landing! Love the "V" tail!!!

I need to get by butt in gear... been dragging my feet and over-thinking things so much... my shoes are worn-out. Meanwhile my airplane sits in pieces waiting for them to be sanded... I hate sanding. Rolling Eyes

roddie Sat Dec 14, 2013 7:42 pm

I checked the weight using a digital postage scale, on 2 different types of pushrods... one being .062" (1/16" dia.) music-wire... the other; .062" dia. carbon-fiber rod.

The music-wire piece at 9" long, weighs .10 oz. or 3 gr. I could not get a weight to register for the carbon-fiber rod... in fact; the carbon rod I weighed is 12" long... with a short 1/16" music-wire Z-bend, spliced with an aluminum tubing sleeve... I have x2 of these carbon rod assy's. for another model I'm building... and BOTH yield no reading in either oz. or grams.. on my scale.

This could make a HUGE difference in your speed models' cg. If you're "tail-heavy" after painting and installation of a music-wire pushrod.. you could very possibly correct the condition by switching to a carbon-fiber pushrod. You actually gain 2-fold... by correcting a cg issue while "lightening" the model... which is not usually an option at finish time. The same applies if you opted early-on, for a carbon pushrod and are excessively "nose-heavy"... switching to a music-wire pushrod will add a considerable amount of weight to the tail... yes; you're adding weight here... but at least it's "functional" weight.

9" length 1/16" dia. music-wire (weight-below)

CEF speed contest Design Discussions - Page 13 Weight10

CEF speed contest Design Discussions - Page 13 Weight10

"TWO" 12" length 1/16" dia. carbon-fiber rods with 1/16" dia. m.w. links installed (weight-below)

CEF speed contest Design Discussions - Page 13 Weight11

Any questions?

ebeneezer Tue Dec 17, 2013 11:33 am

Hi guys just a quick question regarding the rules. Whilst doing research for my model I.ve found something more unusual. How about a Piaggio-Pegna PC7? Sadley using a Hydrofoil to take off, it has no wheels. Is it in the rules for me to lay down a piece of some sort smooth board so I can ROG off the hydrofoil? Once I can rember how again!!! I'll post pics.

Cheers. Flying

ebeneezer Tue Dec 17, 2013 11:47 am

CEF speed contest Design Discussions - Page 13 Pegna-10

CEF speed contest Design Discussions - Page 13 Piaggi12

Is this crying out to be built?

Cheers Flying

OVERLORD Tue Dec 17, 2013 12:56 pm

Very cool Mike, although the real one never flew, R/C models did.

Lieven

pkrankow Tue Dec 17, 2013 3:47 pm

OVERLORD wrote:Very cool Mike, although the real one never flew, R/C models did.

Lieven

Apparently a full-size prototype was built though.
http://xplanes.tumblr.com/post/120602829/schneider-trophy-special-cowes-1929-the-oddest

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Piaggio_P.7

Phil

JPvelo Tue Dec 17, 2013 8:38 pm

ebeneezer wrote:

Is this crying out to be built?

Cheers

I thought for sure you would build the Buggatti, that's why I've already pondered a plane that was built but never flew. I'm going to say it's ok because a prototype was built and and tested in the water. Also because I considered building it myself lol!

However in the interest of fairness I think it needs two wheels dangling in the breeze like all the other entries. I'm sure you could tuck a wheel in the hydrofoil and have it be visually unobtrusive. I actually considered building a Supermarine Schneider Cup racer with wheels hidden in the floats.

Jim

JPvelo Tue Dec 17, 2013 8:47 pm

Entry #2 roughed out:
CEF speed contest Design Discussions - Page 13 KxmYRyw

CEF speed contest Design Discussions - Page 13 7naiMPD

Jim

roddie Tue Dec 17, 2013 9:11 pm

JPvelo wrote:Entry #2 roughed out:

Jim

Nice Jim! I like how you angled the grain on the wing panels.

Roddie

Mark Boesen Tue Dec 17, 2013 10:07 pm

JPvelo wrote:Templates for speed plane #2:

Any guesses?

Jim

CEF speed contest Design Discussions - Page 13 Miss_a10

CEF speed contest Design Discussions - Page 13 Miss_a11

Mark Boesen Tue Dec 17, 2013 10:18 pm

Ok, I give up. Not sayin I'm gonna build anything, but was wondering where are the rules for this contest? I'm starting to think that there's some old dried caster oil soaked wheels slowly starting to turn????

maybe...
CEF speed contest Design Discussions - Page 13 Stille10

CEF speed contest Design Discussions - Page 13 Stille10

or a...

CEF speed contest Design Discussions - Page 13 Tsunam11

JPvelo Tue Dec 17, 2013 10:45 pm

Mark Boesen wrote:
JPvelo wrote:Templates for speed plane #2:

Any guesses?

Jim

Yep, Miss Ashley ll. Scratch built P-51 fuse with wing and tail from a Lear Jet.
CEF speed contest Design Discussions - Page 13 1YPhj1P

Jim

JPvelo Tue Dec 17, 2013 10:48 pm

Mark Boesen wrote:Ok, I give up. Not sayin I'm gonna build anything, but was wondering where are the rules for this contest? I'm starting to think that there's some old dried caster oil soaked wheels slowly starting to turn????

https://www.coxengineforum.com/t5898-cef-profile-scale-reed-speed-rules

Mark Boesen Tue Dec 17, 2013 10:49 pm

thanks

duke.johnson Tue Dec 17, 2013 11:45 pm

Mark- Build the Stiletto and enter. The Stiletto is sexy!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

RK Flyer Wed Dec 18, 2013 12:23 am

Duke, Which Stilleto? The one with the Mid Engine?

RK Flyer

OVERLORD Wed Dec 18, 2013 2:14 am

navion34 wrote:Thanks Lieven, I will call them,

Don't bother Rémy, I was there yesterday to pick Oracover for the Satan and the smallest prop they have for IC engines is the grey Graupner prop 5x2.

Lieven

OVERLORD Wed Dec 18, 2013 5:08 am

RK Flyer wrote:Duke, Which Stilleto? The one with the Mid Engine?

RK Flyer

That is a nice plane. It was featured in American Aircraft Modeler 12.1970. Kirt has a page about it:

http://www.airplanesandrockets.com/airplanes/stiletto-dec-1970-aam.htm

However, it was conceived as a model without an existing 1:1 version. For the dawing, go to Outerzone.

Lieven

Mark Boesen Wed Dec 18, 2013 9:59 am

duke.johnson wrote:Mark- Build the Stiletto and enter. The Stiletto is sexy!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

The Tsunami would be the easier build, wing and stab are pretty straight lines, but your right the Stiletto ROCKS!!!!

RK Flyer Wed Dec 18, 2013 10:28 am

I started the Stilleto about a month before the Contest started, its on hold now and I am working on the P-39 Airacorba a true Mid Engine fighter and racer for the contest. Its taken awhile to work out the details and I have a couple of versions of the drive train to test. I'll post results soon.

RK Flyer

JPvelo Wed Dec 18, 2013 11:16 am

RK Flyer wrote:
I started the Stilleto about a month before the Contest started, its on hold now and I am working on the P-39 Airacorba a true Mid Engine fighter and racer for the contest. Its taken awhile to work out the details and I have a couple of versions of the drive train to test. I'll post results soon.

RK Flyer

I can't wait to see what you come up with.

Jim

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