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Post  Admin Fri Sep 16, 2011 10:19 pm

I just had another one of them pop in the basement. It was screwed in about 6 months ago or so, used everyday for at least an hour. Now these don't burn out like regular incandescent bulbs or even a regular florescent tube, these make a loud "pop" and smell like burning plastic. The last 3 I had all burnt out that way. I opened one of the 3 that popped like that and have found that it was the electrolytic capacitor. The only other time I have ever had a electrolytic capacitor blow was in a old tube radio. The radio was 70 years old and worked for about 2-3 hours at least once every few weeks. I have since fixed the radio and it still sings today. A regular florescent light that uses replaceable tubes either has a ballast or a starter that was built to be used over and over therefore it lasts. If they would make a compact screw-in ballast that was built to last and sold spiral tubes that could be fitted to the top of the ballast, then maybe more people would like them and they would be more safe. My cousin is a firefighter and he said they have responded to so many calls about CFLs smoking, flaming, smelling burnt and melting. They have also responded to a few fires that were ruled to to have been caused by a faulty CFL. I myself do no like them. They are not a perfect replacement for every application a incandescent bulb would be used in. These bulbs including my florescent shop lights do not like to light up in temps below 20°F and in these Minnesota winters, it can go well below that! I currently use 2 regular 100 watt incandescent bulbs in my garage since a CFL is going to fail in the winter. Either it will flicker or glow very dimly, the shop lights just flicker for about 15 minutes until it warms up while the CFLs seem to take much longer. I do not like the light output of most CFLs, they can be a fire hazard, the mercury vapor is highly dangerous (even though it is a very small amount) and do not last as long as advertised to.
I know exactly why they are not lasting as long as they should, I turn them on and off too much! I would get close to a year out of a incandescent bulb when I have been only getting 5-6 months out of a CFL. I am not very happy about the 30sec-1min warm up period either, I want my light when I turn it on! Just last June, the Minnesota EPA did some tests on the landfills and noticed a spike in mercury since the last test in 2007. People are not recycling them so mainly it is doing more harm then good. I noticed that our local hardware store will only take CFLs or regular tubes if you buy replacements from them. Our local Menards takes them for free but who wants to drive your bulbs away each time you need to change them. Since they will be removing my 100 watts from the shelves in the beginning of 2012, I have stocked up on them! I do believe we have to be energy efficient but not by ruining the light you use everyday.

Sorry about all the typing about CFLs! I don't hate them, I hate the fact that we are being forced to use them in every application. I do believe they have to have a better made ballast since the ballast is usually the first to go far before the tube goes bad.
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Post  Cz10 Sat Sep 17, 2011 12:58 am

I am about 1/2 way thru installing about 150 lightbulbs in my new house. They are ALL fluorescent of some type. The ones in the hobby room, garage and some utility rooms are F32T8 with 5000K color temp. That is about 40% of the total. Great bulbs. Then there are a bunch of ceiling cans. In was lucky enough to escape having to put fluorescent only fixtures in. The bulb choices are a LOT more limited and a LOT more $ because they got you by the short hairs if you are locked into something specific for that fixture. I figure the best technology at the lowest price will always be available to replace standard medium base bulbs. I wanted 5000K full spectrum bulbs through out. I also wanted to be able to dim about 20 of those cans. All this comes at a price. LED technology is currently too expensive and I feel not mature enough. They say the price will drop about 80% in the next year. That takes care of one problem and icreased market share will take care of the others. Meanwhile, I got a s--t pot of CFL bulbs! I'll let you know how it works for me.

Here is the lighting in the hobby room that my wife and I will share. Jewelry for her along the wall to the right under thYe windows, with a small bench for me all the way at the right end and the blue/brown wall area is for the Lionel train lIayout - one of my other hobbies.






CFLs Who else here hates them? IMAGE_1000000151


CFLs Who else here hates them? IMAGE_1000000150

The main room has fluorescent soffit lighting that I really like



CFLs Who else here hates them? IMAGE_1000000069

The kitchen is part of that room and uses the same lighting



CFLs Who else here hates them? IMAGE_1000000070

There will be some additional area specific lighting, but I really like how it is working out so far.

I have about a dozen exterior lights plus 6 double flood light fixtures for security lighting. The dozen fixtures are a TOTAL of 95 watts. We'll se how those do in the colder months. We get down into the 20's at times. More typically the 30's.
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Post  Admin Sat Sep 17, 2011 11:28 am

Nice place! I see you are using the standard tube fixtures, those should be fine. I'm just complaining about the fact that the CFLs have a very poor ballast and that the ballast is disposed of with the entire bulb. The CFLs I have a issue with are the extra cheap ones, ones I purchased for about $1.50 a bulb. Those cheap ones are not worth it at all. I have had good luck with these Walmart ones. I bought them about 3 years ago and the 2 I am using are still working today! One of them gets a lot of use!

CFLs Who else here hates them? Only_g10

I bought some Sylvania 23 watt (100 watt replacements) for use with my generator, and well, that was a bad idea. It was on for about 20 minutes and then it just went out. Because of the ever changing frequency and voltage output of my generator, it fried the ballast that was trying to keep the bulb lit steady. I now just use a 72 watt halogen that can take the instant voltage spikes or drops and the frequency changes. When my stock of regular incandescent bulbs runs out, I'll just use halogen since I do seem to like those. I still only use the incandescent bulbs in my table lamps since I like the light tone and output. I do have CFLs all over the basement, in the backroom, furnace room etc...
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Post  Cz10 Sat Sep 17, 2011 2:07 pm

It is about 90 standard tubes F32T8 and F28T5 for the soffet lighting. The balance are mostly CFL reflector bulbs except for the 12 fixtures outside and 4 in the hallway. The bill for the bulbs was around $2k... I hope I don't have the same experiences as you with the CFL's.
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Post  PV Pilot Sat Sep 17, 2011 2:08 pm

Had good luck with the sylvania soft whites, the Dollar Tree cheapies,,not so good.

Both made by the CH-ina company, one is made with a bit better quality control.
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Post  GermanBeez Sun Sep 18, 2011 3:48 am

well, i have got high quality philips cfls in my room....thats bull.
these things burn out in the matter of months and it gets pretty hard to breathe due to the merc vape
when one pops. yeah, i've seen caps blow on some of them too.
the problem is that in 2009 or so, germany passed a law prohibiting the further retail of normal light bulbs.
WHY? I DON'T KNOW! they might save energy, but mercury vapour being released into the air doesn't
really speak for them...
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Post  nitroairplane Sun Sep 18, 2011 5:08 am

Mercury vapour!!
Scheiße that that's is not safe at all.
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Post  Cz10 Sun Sep 18, 2011 9:20 am

GermanBeez wrote:well, i have got high quality philips cfls in my room....thats bull.
these things burn out in the matter of months and it gets pretty hard to breathe due to the merc vape
when one pops. yeah, i've seen caps blow on some of them too.
the problem is that in 2009 or so, germany passed a law prohibiting the further retail of normal light bulbs.
WHY? I DON'T KNOW! they might save energy, but mercury vapour being released into the air doesn't
really speak for them...

Starts here next year I believe.

In the exterior fixtures on my new house, in was able to provide the same amount of light with a total of 95 watts that would be 360 with incandescent. So, they USE less energy to produce light. As far as the extra energy to produce CFL vs. Incandescent and the hazmat disposal issues, different story I'm sure.

It DOES irk me that there is no convenient system for disposal of something that is mandated by the building code (flourescents or some equal are required in the kitchen and bathroom) and essentially being forced on us by eliminating the current alternative by an act of law. I feel that I should be able to take them back to the place of purchase for disposal. If you don't want to handle the waste, then you can't sell them. It should be the same way with batteries.


Last edited by Cz10 on Sun Sep 18, 2011 9:46 am; edited 1 time in total
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Post  SuperDave Sun Sep 18, 2011 9:38 am

I understand the lighting issue well and the opions expressed here reflect mine.

Shop lighting and detail lighting are two different matters. For detail work I use a portable desktop model Ott Lite from JoAnn Fabrics usually on sale for less than $40. The light features a 2X "flip up" magnifier and a swivel base. Further the height of the light may be adjusted up or down. The technology of an Ott Lite is well worth reference in the 'net".

The mentioned light has many useages as I've used mine for modeling as well as tying trout flies. When my wife first "copped" mine for needpoint I bought her a floor model for her own use. If there is a disadvantage it is that Ott light is visually peircing when viewed directly so the light is best placed so as not be viewed in that manner.

My desktop is a model OLT13MAG (BTW, OTL does NOT stand for "out to lunch" Laughing

SD
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Post  Cz10 Sun Sep 18, 2011 9:56 am

I should comment the I have been using some CFLs in our current house for some time now and have not experienced the early failure issues reported by others here. The ones in the kitchen have been in service for years, as have about a half dozen others elsewhere in the house. I have only had one fail and not in a catastrophic manner like described. So my only complaint is coming up to full brightness slowly. Some are worse then others and some in the new house don't do it at all. I think those might be the ones that are "Dimmable/Flashable" .
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Post  Admin Sun Sep 18, 2011 11:25 am

Its fun to open up a new box of CFLs to find one is already broken for you!

I took this picture awhile ago, I'm sure I got rid of the bulb by now.
CFLs Who else here hates them? Broken10

I have tried the Dimmable ones and I am not pleased. You are not supposed to use them on a resistive "rheostat" dimmer switch. My cousin's house was built back in the early 1900s, has all the original electrical wiring (knob & tube) and has some early (1940s) dimmer switches in the dining room and bedroom. Those dimmer switches are rheostat dimmer switches and he blew a new dimmable CFL in just 10 minutes. The one in the bedroom lasted only a week because the switch was up all the way (full bright), it was still not completely open as a single pole switch is so it was still resisting a little.
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Post  SuperDave Sun Sep 18, 2011 11:41 am

I believe these new circular bulbs with soon go the way of the "eco-friendly" 1.6 Liter toilet which took TWO flushes to do the job required by a "#2".

Having "speced" two houses in the era of the federally-mandated 1.6L toilet I hustled myself up to British Columbia where they are not so "progressive" in their thinking.

ONE flush does "it" at both of those houses and the environment is the better for it.

SD
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Post  MiniatureAircraftFactory Mon Sep 19, 2011 10:58 am

I hate CFLs , ive have a few that flash on there own at night , house light ones seem very bad with a short life
i do have some great big ones i grow plants with ,they seem to last much better and light up immediately, they use 100w of power, i use them to replace metal halide 400w grow light bulbs


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Post  GermanBeez Mon Sep 19, 2011 11:20 am

MiniatureAircraftFactory wrote:I hate CFLs , ive have a few that flash on there own at night

wow, that's a new one... Shocked
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Post  Admin Mon Sep 19, 2011 11:26 pm

I would also like to add, I had a few CFLs overheat just because I had one in ceiling fan and another in a ceiling globe light. I would like to know what I can use in those once the incandescent bulbs are gone? It says right on the CFL package "do not use in enclosed fixtures".

I'm actually just going to keep using the old bulbs as long as I can. LEDs are still too expensive and the technology is still immature. I have played with those LED lamps and those are currently a joke. The light quality is exactly like a led flashlight and if you look at it just right, you can even see the 60hz frequency flicker. I just don't think we are ready to replace something that works for something that slightly works. $7.99 for 1 (one) LED lamp that is equal to a 11 watt sign bulb. I am not happy Mad
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Post  SuperDave Tue Sep 20, 2011 9:40 am

I'm not so sure thate "hate" the issue here. They are currently in vogue because the federal government had mandated them for effectentcy reasons.

Again my experience with the 1.6 liter toilet is an illustration of where a federal mandate may have certain problems indicating a lackof through research. It's not the concept but the reality of any "green" innovation that's important.

SD
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Post  Cz10 Tue Sep 20, 2011 10:39 pm

Arrrrrrrrrgh!!!!

I just discovered one of the 11 5W I have in the outside fixtures failed already.... Sylvania brand....
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Post  Admin Tue Sep 20, 2011 10:44 pm

Cz10 wrote:Arrrrrrrrrgh!!!!

I just discovered one of the 11 5W I have in the outside fixtures failed already.... Sylvania brand....

ALREADY! see, CFLs are a failure. For all my outside fixtures, I use incandescent bulbs. 2 reasons, 1) we have cold winters and they just don't work in temps below 20°F. 2) Moisture+high voltage electronics= not so good.

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Post  GermanBeez Wed Sep 21, 2011 9:50 am

SuperDave wrote:I'm not so sure thate "hate" the issue here. They are currently in vogue because the federal government had mandated them for effectentcy reasons.

Again my experience with the 1.6 liter toilet is an illustration of where a federal mandate may have certain problems indicating a lackof through research. It's not the concept but the reality of any "green" innovation that's important.

SD
ah, we don't hate em, really Smile
in my opinion, they were just thrown on the market without really being fully developed. i think if the
producers would have taken the time to look through the problems with these lamps, they would be products
of much higher quality today.
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Post  Cz10 Wed Sep 21, 2011 10:30 am

Moisture is not an issue here, at least this time of year. Typical humidity during the day us 25 - 30%. I have seen it get down to 9%.
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Post  Admin Wed Sep 21, 2011 10:54 am

GermanBeez wrote:
ah, we don't hate em, really Smile
in my opinion, they were just thrown on the market without really being fully developed. i think if the
producers would have taken the time to look through the problems with these lamps, they would be products
of much higher quality today.

I replaced the capacitor in one of them that blew with one of . a higher voltage and slightly higher mfd. The bulb worked and still does. I'm guessing the cap is being used as a condenser while the other smaller one is being used as a line filter to filter out the 60hz frequency and convert AC to DC. I would really have to look at the circuit more to see what is being used as what.
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Post  GermanBeez Wed Sep 21, 2011 11:07 am

Admin wrote:
GermanBeez wrote:
ah, we don't hate em, really Smile
in my opinion, they were just thrown on the market without really being fully developed. i think if the
producers would have taken the time to look through the problems with these lamps, they would be products
of much higher quality today.

I replaced the capacitor in one of them that blew with one of . a higher voltage and slightly higher mfd. The bulb worked and still does. I'm guessing the cap is being used as a condenser while the other smaller one is being used as a line filter to filter out the 60hz frequency and convert AC to DC. I would really have to look at the circuit more to see what is being used as what.
one of them is probably used to give a high voltage starting jolt, just like a neon bulb.(they sort
of look alike, right?). the cap gives off its stored charge in a very short amount of time, and depending on how you connect it (inline or parallel), it gives you either high voltage or current.
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