Re: Couple Kittens followed me home..

Michpatriot Sat Feb 04, 2023 9:15 pm

Dave Thin C\A? or medium? I'm going to seal around the bladder tube real good..yep ill be sealing the seams for sure. C\G seems good by feel its halfway from the main spar to the rear inside of the leading edge..just about centered under bladder tube..I think ill use pretty close line spacing at the Sig handle..

Michpatriot Sat Feb 04, 2023 9:57 pm

And on the C/G..

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About 1-1/2" back from leading edge..

Dono?

aspeed Sat Feb 04, 2023 11:26 pm

Cg is likely a good start. I like your pinch off clip. I may try that on my F2D planes. I was going to try the office type spring clips this year, but this looks better. I really don't like starting with bladders. Luckily I get some help there at the bean field. Like the ideas for the golf ball for a mold. Would a ping pong ball work? I have some of the Little Red Caps that I have not tried yet. They are supposed to be good for 1/2A. Less pressure so the needle is not quite as sensitive. Alan

Michpatriot Sat Feb 04, 2023 11:58 pm

Thanks for the look at the C\G! Dono about the ping pong ball idea.. somebody else was posting about the pop bottle molding..

HalfaDave Sun Feb 05, 2023 12:55 am

Hi Mich,

With that geometry, use your regular handle. I like 42ft 20#fishing line.
It will go like snot.
Figure 8's will be your friend.
Landing upright, is an art...
Take care,
Have fun,
Dave

P.S. Dollar Store CA glue. Get it where the castor oil wants to soak in....

HalfaDave Sun Feb 05, 2023 2:14 am

Hi Mich,

You can wrap solder around the front end of your Cox, to get the CG fwd.
It will slow things down a bit, then peel it back to your liking...

I have an undefeated 'Piranna' own design, with a BlackWidow.
It scares both Ring Masters and Flight Streaks....

We fear, a nice stable Kitten will turn inside us...

Towing streamers is fun,
No kidding!
Put a streamer on it.
It is a Combat Kitten,
It is fun,
Take care,
Have fun,
Dave

Mike1484 Sun Feb 05, 2023 3:49 am

Everything looks good, hope the bladder is loose in its tube when fueled up. I don't have the plans for the kitten, but the big cat shows the C/G a bit closer to the leading edge. A tail heavy 1/2a does not last very long. The plane looks very nice form and function wise .
Mike1484

Mike1484 Sun Feb 05, 2023 5:03 am

Checked an old handbook "Secrets of model airplane building by Sterling models". It showed a picture that the C/G should not be back behind the leading edge more than 25% of the wing cord. That seems pretty generous to me. I would think 20% would be a good starting point and move back for a more responsive control .
Mike1484

getback Sun Feb 05, 2023 7:38 am

Nice clean job on the bladder tube , have you test ran it yet ?

Ken Cook Sun Feb 05, 2023 7:52 am

I myself wouldn't use 42' lines for a reedy. Until a woodie gets up to speed it can be a herky jerky ride for a lap. Make certain that you sight the plane from the rear and insure that the trailing edge is centered all the way across the plane. If it isn't reheat your covering and twist it further than what it's warped and let it cool in your hand for a bit. Putting a 5-6' streamer on the plane can also tame a twitchy plane. One thing that can help until it's been trimmed out is to tape a nickel on the outboard wing with some clear packing tape just to offer a bit more tip weight for the initial flight. Just like Half A Dave suggested, remove it after flight.

I fly it level insuring that it's not banked up or down on the end of the lines. If the outboard tip is high, when you go inverted the plane can potentially fly across the circle. If all looks good, I do wide maneuvers insuring that the line tension is the same on inside and outside maneuvers. If it gets light one way vs the other then you have a possible warp. I then trim for speed. I want enough elevator to turn but not too much where it stalls. This is where a tall horn comes in handy as it offers some adjustment.

Michpatriot Sun Feb 05, 2023 9:05 am

getback wrote:Nice clean job on the bladder tube , have you test ran it yet ?

Thanks it was a chore for sure..Haven't run it yet..maybe Monday if its warm ill run it in the shop.

Michpatriot Sun Feb 05, 2023 9:15 am

Streamer✓ any body have a C\G location off the kitten plans? Ill see where 20% lies at..Thank you guys for all the replies, kind words and shared wisdom..

HalfaDave Sun Feb 05, 2023 2:12 pm

Hi Mich,

I am looking for a book of plans that I think has the Kitten plans.
Know I have it some where, it will be in the last place I look...

Should have the CG and streamer attatch details...

Later,
Dave

aspeed Sun Feb 05, 2023 2:40 pm

Just a quick Yahoo search give me a free plan service . Maybe Aerofred The balance is very far forward just at the back of the leading edge piece. https://freercplans.com/plan-combat-kittens-4205.htm

HalfaDave Sun Feb 05, 2023 2:55 pm

Hi Mich,
Found it!

AMA Kit Plan Book Volume One. Compiled by Frank Ehling.
No date I can find, gotta be late sixties...

The Kitten has the CG at the back edge of the LE stock.
Further fwd than similar combat wings, which are ~20% back from LE.

No details on streamer attatch on any of them...
Ken will know...

Hope this helps,
Dave

P.S. I gotta put this book back where I found it, got enough projects on the go already ! Smile

Ken Cook Sun Feb 05, 2023 4:56 pm

One thing I noticed immediately when I built my first one was it flew better than ANY Lil Satan I owned. It was night and day. Having two in a box made it even better. I built several of them but I still own one unbuilt from the original box when I made the first one.

Mike1484 Sun Feb 05, 2023 6:01 pm

More good stuff here. C.G position, trimming info and the fact that it will out fly a Li'l Satan is all good stuff. Can't wait to here how it flys . My C.G position is for the big cat and is wrong, look at the kitten plans it is way forwad.
Mike1484

Ken Cook Sun Feb 05, 2023 6:21 pm

As far as streamer attachment is concerned, drill a hole in the outboard boom and tie it on.

Michpatriot Sun Feb 05, 2023 8:16 pm

Thanks SO much everyone! Got some figuring to do. Tempting to skeletonize the Basswood elevator and see what that's worth on the C\G Probably would balance better with a Tee Dee on a bolt on beam mount...hmm Toledo show is coming might need to go TeeDee shopping..or do I add to the existing mount layering it up to get the postage stamp engine forward and a couple holes in the bass wood elevator to loose tail weight...I'm so glad I have the C\G info..probably woulda been like a bottle rocket without the stick..maybe ill find a Kitten kit at Toledo show too!

P.S. if any forum members need really small precise TIG welding I run small welding business in Livonia Mi and might be able to help..
alloys like titanium and aluminum or stainless are no problem..I've saved a lot of little precious items over the years for people and companies.
Don't be afraid to ask..

Michpatriot Sun Feb 05, 2023 8:47 pm

Ken Cook wrote: One thing I noticed immediately when I built my first one was it flew better than ANY Lil Satan I owned. It was night and day. Having two in a box made it even better. I built several of them but I still own one unbuilt from the original box when I made the first one.

So cool! What a precious kit that is! I'm going to start looking for one.

Michpatriot Sun Feb 05, 2023 8:55 pm

Ken Cook wrote: As far as streamer attachment is concerned, drill a hole in the outboard boom and tie it on.

That makes sense also keeping lines tight.

Michpatriot Sun Feb 05, 2023 8:56 pm

HalfaDave wrote:Hi Mich,
Found it!

AMA Kit Plan Book Volume One. Compiled by Frank Ehling.
No date I can find, gotta be late sixties...

The Kitten has the CG at the back edge of the LE stock.
Further fwd than similar combat wings, which are ~20% back from LE.

No details on streamer attatch on any of them...
Ken will know...

Hope this helps,
Dave

P.S. I gotta put this book back where I found it, got enough projects on the go already !

Thank you Dave

rdw777 Mon Feb 06, 2023 5:37 am

Dave’s already helped out with the CG info but here’s a visual to go with it…I have the kit… Nice job on the fuel pinch off by the way!!!

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My kit will go in the For Sale section soon…. Little above my pay grade for CL

Michpatriot Mon Feb 06, 2023 7:34 am

Thanks RDW777, I started with sorting out my hand position for gripping the plane while starting and knew I wanted momentary fuel flow with easy changeover to constant fuel flow. Eventually modifying the design of an existing fuel pinch I got from a friend and fabricating the one you see pictured to allow the release of pressure by rocking the side of my index finger onto the wire "button", allowing for prime and fuel control while initial running\starting, once the engine starts I can hold the button and if it stalls just release and fuel flow stops..or if the engine is happily running perfect while the button is held then simply using my right hand push the fuel line down to the "run" position below the pinch area in the little loop of the "button" and your ready for flight..the whole mechinism is also adjustable up and down via two mounting screws on the side of the engine mount for perfect position against the finger\knuckle.

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PM me how much you want for the kit..

Michpatriot Mon Feb 06, 2023 10:55 am

C/G conundrum...engine mocked up 1" forward big loop of solder and still 1" behind the C/G..DOGONE..

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