Re: Building another JR SATAN

OVERLORD Tue May 21, 2013 2:06 pm

Evening Gents,

A small update of the JR Satan project. I didn't get much done due to work and gardening. Initially, I was thinking of using a 2,5 mm piano wire as a pushrod, but in the end, I found it a little massive and decided to use a 2mm wire. It is also closer to what is said on the drawing (5/64).

When I was at Le Havre for the job, I wanted to get some wire at the town model shop just to find out it closed down. I then tried to find something around the house that could do the job. I went through oven grills and barbecue grills but the rods were too thick and mostly not long enough. Seeing the neighbour on his bike brought me the answer: spokes!! The're the right size and have a good length. I found a nice wheel at the local tip and building could finally continue. Instead of bending the wire into a Z, I decided to use stops. I made 2 stops out of a sugar cube-like electrical connector, threw away the plastic bit and cut it in half.

Building another JR SATAN - Page 2 Imgp2710

Building another JR SATAN - Page 2 Imgp2710

I sanded down 1 stop just right so it fits in the space between the bellcrank lower side and the bellcrank mount. I also put some metal lining of coke can material into the control horn hole. I gave the pushrod a small bend to make it fit. Now the elevator falls down under its own weight.

Lieven

Building another JR SATAN - Page 2 Imgp2711

Building another JR SATAN - Page 2 Imgp2711

Building another JR SATAN - Page 2 Imgp2713

**RknRusty** Tue May 21, 2013 3:19 pm

As usual, very nice work, Lieven.

MrGoodwreck Tue May 21, 2013 4:46 pm

This website is killing me.

I have been an R/C guy for years, but now I have had this urge to go back to my roots, and build a couple more U/C planes. My first build as a kid was the Lil Satin.

I have to go out to my old file folders, and see If I can find the plans again.

**RknRusty** Tue May 21, 2013 5:47 pm

Control line flying is just unbelievable fun. It's a full body exercise, especially if you have a really good flying 1/2A ship. An exercise in controlled panic, no such thing as staying at least two mistakes high, as the RCers like to say... as they yawn. Laughing

I'm glad we're luring you back in.

I love my Li'l Satan with its bladder fed Tee Dee, but it's small and light enough to be limited to relatively calm days. I like to fly my Baby Flite Streaks, a bit bigger and much more accurate aerobatics, and can be easily flown in 10mph winds as long as you stay aware of the direction. I have one Baby Streak with a Tee Dee and one with a Norvel .061, both bladder fed, so they never hiccup even at max gees. The first time I flew one, I felt like I had just flown my first 1/2A that was not a toy. I highly recommend one for someone re-entering the hobby.

Check out my Streak in the featured video by clicking on Youtube under my avatar. My Li'l Satan is in the list below that video too.

Rusty

OVERLORD Fri May 31, 2013 1:59 pm

My wife was busy with the the bookkeeping today, so I was banned from the office. As the weather was nice, I felt an engine testing session coming up. I put the Enya 19 VI, that will be mounted on the JR Satan, in the test bench and gave it a spin.

Building another JR SATAN - Page 2 Imgp2815

Building another JR SATAN - Page 2 Imgp2815

I made some short videos of the engine running without and with a muffler. I will upload them and post in the "Other Engines" section.

Lieven

**Cribbs74** Fri May 31, 2013 3:33 pm

It looks superb! Great job cobbling that together. Are you planning on a silk/dope finish?

What type of tank did you settle on?

Ron

OVERLORD Fri Jun 07, 2013 1:51 pm

Thanks for your comments.

Ron, the tank is a 2 Oz tank from Brodak; "medium wedge standard vent" nr BH-477. The Outerzone drawing doesn't say what kind of tank and volume to fit. It just says Veco or Perfect tank.

However, on the plan that came with the kit, it says:

for .15 engines, use Perfect #9 or Veco T23C tank
for .19 engines use Veco T23D tank

Building another JR SATAN - Page 2 Plan_j10

Building another JR SATAN - Page 2 Plan_j10

Now, I haven't got a clue to which volumes these types refere to. I just measured the space between ribs on my blown up plan and chose a tank that hopefully would fit in. Does somebody know if there exist conversion tables for these type numbers to f.i. Brodak type numbers? Maybe M. Brodak himself would know?

For the finish, it will be covered in red Oracover with black painted tail and nacelle. Not very original, I know, but traditional indeed.

Lieven

sdjjadk Fri Jun 07, 2013 8:30 pm

Very nice build!!! I've built a few Lil' Satan's in the past but never a Jr. Satan. After seeing this thread, I might scratch build one.

Shawn

**Cribbs74** Fri Jun 07, 2013 9:24 pm

OVERLORD wrote:Thanks for your comments.

Ron, the tank is a 2 Oz tank from Brodak; "medium wedge standard vent" nr BH-477. The Outerzone drawing doesn't say what kind of tank and volume to fit. It just says Veco or Perfect tank.

However, on the plan that came with the kit, it says:

for .15 engines, use Perfect #9 or Veco T23C tank
for .19 engines use Veco T23D tank

Now, I haven't got a clue to which volumes these types refere to. I just measured the space between ribs on my blown up plan and chose a tank that hopefully would fit in. Does somebody know if there exist conversion tables for these type numbers to f.i. Brodak type numbers? Maybe M. Brodak himself would know?

For the finish, it will be covered in red Oracover with black painted tail and nacelle. Not very original, I know, but traditional indeed.

Lieven

John Brodak does know. If you tell him what Veco or Perfect tank you desire he can cross reference it for you. I believe he bought the rights to the Perfect line.

How are things coming along with the Jr.? I really don't think there is a traditional scheme, the box shows pale blue with a red demon tail extending from the nacelle. I can send you a picture of the box if you desire.

Ron

**Cribbs74** Fri Jun 07, 2013 9:25 pm

OVERLORD wrote:Thanks for your comments.

Ron, the tank is a 2 Oz tank from Brodak; "medium wedge standard vent" nr BH-477. The Outerzone drawing doesn't say what kind of tank and volume to fit. It just says Veco or Perfect tank.

However, on the plan that came with the kit, it says:

for .15 engines, use Perfect #9 or Veco T23C tank
for .19 engines use Veco T23D tank

Now, I haven't got a clue to which volumes these types refere to. I just measured the space between ribs on my blown up plan and chose a tank that hopefully would fit in. Does somebody know if there exist conversion tables for these type numbers to f.i. Brodak type numbers? Maybe M. Brodak himself would know?

For the finish, it will be covered in red Oracover with black painted tail and nacelle. Not very original, I know, but traditional indeed.

Lieven

John Brodak does know. If you tell him what Veco or Perfect tank you desire he can cross reference it for you. I believe he bought the rights to the Perfect line.

How are things coming along with the Jr.? I really don't think there is a traditional scheme, the box shows pale blue with a red demon tail extending from the nacelle. I can send you a picture of the box if you desire.

I also have decals for the Jr. If you need some.

Ron

Ken Cook Sat Jun 08, 2013 9:15 am

Hello Lieven, I have a question in regards to your covering. Oracover as I've come to know it has a white waxy like paper backing. Is this correct? I have some here with the trademark name on it. I've been told this is the same product as Ultracote. However, the Ultracote I see here in the states feels more vinyl like and doesn't appear to look like the Oracover. I also noticed that the heat range is quite low compared to other iron on coverings I have. Too hot and it retreats from the area rapidly. Is this a product from England? Many of the coverings, aka: Nelson lite fab, Solorcover, and Coverite all have origins from England. The reason I ask is due to trying to place one color of the other which I wasn't successful in doing. I used this over a foam wing and regardless of heat range, it initially holds but tends to release. Obviously this is bad. I never tried it over wood frame work. Ken

OVERLORD Sat Jun 08, 2013 11:54 am

Ken, When I went to the shop, I asked for Oracover and they gave me the dimensions I needed. I didn't have a closer look at it because I didn't reach the covering stage yet. Now you asked the question I had a look and indeed, it matches your description: greasy or waxy-like backing paper with the Oracover name.

Building another JR SATAN - Page 2 Oracov10

Building another JR SATAN - Page 2 Oracov10

Mine says "Ferrarirot", Ferrari red, -must be fast colour!?- It's German. Here is their download page in English with instructions for downloading :

http://www.oracover.de/?&content=downloads&action=viewcat&id=18&page=1&

Lieven

OVERLORD Wed Jun 12, 2013 3:06 am

cribbs74 wrote:

I really don't think there is a traditional scheme, the box shows pale blue with a red demon tail extending from the nacelle. I can send you a picture of the box if you desire.

I also have decals for the Jr. If you need some.

Ron

Ron, Thanks for the offer, I got a picture from the box and I have some other decals in mind to put on the wing. Let it be a surprise.

What I meant by "traditional" was that the colour scheme will be in the tradition of the planes made by Jim, Rusty or Ken.

Lieven

**Cribbs74** Wed Jun 12, 2013 9:16 am

Hey don't leave me out! Lol...

Building another JR SATAN - Page 2 TduK63fl

OVERLORD Wed Jun 12, 2013 2:05 pm

Coming events cast there shadow before.

OVERLORD Fri Jun 28, 2013 9:33 am

Here's a little update of the building process. I boxed the trailing edge to give it more strength. The centre section is entirely sheeted. As my leading edge is thicker than indicated in the drawings, the forward flaired edge of the balsa planking could not butt against the LE to give it a bit of support (or is that only to make it look nice?) but had to be glued on top. So I decided to make it square and leave the flairs away. Instead, I glued a bracket against the back of the LE and the rib.

On the top side I managed to taper the edge of the sheeting before sanding it flush. On the underside, I cut out a recess in the trailing edge where the sheeting could be glued into.

The engine mounting studs were then glued with epoxy and with the engine bolted on to make sure they're in the right position. Next, the nacelle was fixed.

Lieven

Building another JR SATAN - Page 2 Imgp3210

Building another JR SATAN - Page 2 Imgp3210

Building another JR SATAN - Page 2 Imgp3310

Building another JR SATAN - Page 2 Imgp3311

navion34 Fri Jun 28, 2013 4:00 pm

Very good job Lieven

ian1954 Sat Jun 29, 2013 4:47 pm

This is coming on a treat. It is a very neat and tidy build.

We used to use the oval Colmans Mustard tins for tanks in wings (and combat models)

Building another JR SATAN - Page 2 Colman11

Building another JR SATAN - Page 2 Colman11

They were usually the right size and shape to fit wings for 15's (2.5cc) and up.

Alas, these tins are no longer made and are collectors items! Not a free source of tanks! (although you had to like mustard)