Corehouse Models

Why does the SL require a remote needle? What prevents a regular needle from being used? The SL kit says it includes all the hardware, but the description says the mount is separately sold. I sent him an email. I will see what he says.

Rolla, your running a bladder. You really need a fine threaded needle assembly for running bladder. The LA .25 comes with a stock rear mounted needle on the backplate. That needle will hold bladder pressure but the threads are too coarse for a good adj. The other problem with that backplate is that it sticks out higher than the wing itself. If you hit the ground your breaking off the backplate. In the event your in search of mounts I do sell them. Ken

My intent was to start with a Fox 35. I highly doubt I will go to competition with this specific plane. I need to get used to the feel first. I was intrigued at how it mentioned being able to tame the throws and slowly unleash its full potential. My father does have an 25 La-S that I could use if necessary. The Psycho has an optional 48 inch wing. It also says it comes with wood mounts. I have an unknown brand needle valve that I need to try on bladder. I am not sure how it will react to it.

Rolla

The super slow would use a Fox .35 and this would just require a hard tank. That would work fine. Like I said the Gotcha SL uses a bladder and has no provisions for a tank. I know Phil could certainly steer you to what you would need to use for a Fox .35. Ken

What is the difference between the Super Slow and the SL? This is the one I was looking at. http://home.earthlink.net/~philcartier/webcat/Descriptions/SpeedLimitSL.html

Here is the Psycho. http://home.earthlink.net/~philcartier/webcat/Descriptions/psychokit.html

Let me just explain the differences of combat first.

Slow combat was flown using Fox.35's. That event pretty much isn't flown anymore as speed limit took over.Speed limit planes are not supposed to exceed 75 mph. The SL plane is designed for this event and the engine that Phil uses is the LA .25. This engine balances perfectly on this design and when using the stock venturi and a 8x4 prop it will hit the speed limit mark perfectly towing a streamer.The wingspan is almost 48" and 460 square inches. The SL design has no provisions for a tank and also require aluminum mounts.

The Psycho is larger and has more square inches and is designed to be a FAST combat plane which flies at speeds over 100 mph. Fast combat is still flown at the Nats and also in the northwest.This model is intended to use bladder in which this plane has no provision for a tank and also require aluminum mounts. It can be flown with a smaller engines.

What you need to explain to Phil is that you want to fly a plane using a Fox.35. Phil probably still has models that use the Fox.35. One that comes to mind is the Gotcha which used a 500 sq" wing and it had a built up body vs a arrowshaft body.

Most people are using bladders today. Seeing that you just want to fly for fun which is cool as well. Phil can certainly provide you with more info on this. I have a Gotcha here that has a tank and a Fox.35 for power and it flies extremely well. It was an older design of Phil's which is probably 10 years old. I converted it to a speed limit plane and I have a bladder in it now.Ken

Can you elaborate more on what the Gotcha is? Most of his planes have Gotcha in the name. I.E. Gotcha Psycho, Gotcha SL... I would prefer a flying wing. I love the looks.

Rolla

Here is my Gotcha that is one of Phil's older designs. I made it like a Flite Streak adding a rudder and the colors. As you can see, there's room behind the engine for a tank. I shortened this plane's nose by 1 1/2" to add this ball bearing engine you see on there and the bladder compartment was added in the wing as well.




The wings you were inquiring about in the photos are designed to be run using bladder. Truth be told, any engine should run on bladder. The question is, would you run a Fox.35 on bladder ? If so, how long before it decides to depart? The engine wasn't designed for it but it will run well on a tank. Phil has several names for his planes and I'm flying the most current which is the SL. I would bet he has some designs not listed on his site that would be what your looking for. Ken

What do you mean by depart? Will it wear out the Fox? Even if I do a constant break?

What I'm suggesting Rolla is to not run a Fox.35 on bladder. It's an old design engine that works quite well using a tank. In the days of super slow, the Fox.35's were using 8x6 props on a tank usually a chicken hopper.There are wings designed to be used with the Fox.35. Modern wings like the ones you have your eye on use bladder. Running an engine on bladder has it running in a full blown 2 stroke which in the case of a Fox.35 could result in something breaking. When running a tank the engine can cycle back and forth from a lean to rich run. It's important to let Phil know that your running a Fox.35 and he would be able to direct you as to what plane would work the best. Ken

I see. Then this greatly limits my options. What are tank options for the Voodoo? I realize the foam wings and the Voodoo are two completely different animals. I just enjoy flying wing planes.

Rolla, you certainly have many options. One that comes into mind is the Dick Mathis Mongoose. I feel this plane which flies quite well is a good match for the Fox.35. The plane isn't foam, but it is a constant chord wing (all ribs are the same). The controls are internal with the tank being mounted like a profile. It does have a narrow fuse with a stab no rudder. Quite simple to build and it uses a 1/2" square leading edge unlike the Voodoo which uses a solid 1" leading edge. The solid 1" leading edges are getting quite difficult to locate creating even more work if you choose to make it. I do in fact have plans for the Mongoose but they're really falling apart and I hope I can even get them to the copy machine as they're that bad. On the other hand, Dick made an additional model which is the Ercoupe which uses the same wing and basic design but has twin rudders on the ends of the stab.I have those plans as well which are in good shape. Both of these planes were designed with the Fox.35 in mind and these are very maneuverable. They have 38" wingspan and are quite fast. In the event you do go with a Voodoo you probably want to go with a 3-3 1/2 oz medium wedge. The Voodoo flies better when flying fast. It does have a poorer turning rate than most wings. It flies better than the Demon with the diamond airfoil.

Both of the Mathis designed planes are on my to do list as a few other of my club members have them. They're great for sport and knocking around and on windy days when the bigger stuff is getting beat up by the wind. In the event of ground impacts, they're easy to repair and all in all just a simple design that keeps the interest going. Ken

Ken

My favorite and best flying was Mathis Mongoose....I have searched far and wide for an unbuilt kit...no soap

If you ever rerpoduce the plans I am interested in a copy....no hurry

I will certainly get these copied as my prints are in bad shape now. These are indeed great little planes. If interested, Larry Rice from Blackhawk actually rekitted the Mongoose in laser cut parts. Not exactly the identical outline, but extremely close and ideally priced. Certainly a great plane for knocking around. Ken

The kit arrived today. I like the laser cut ply pieces. The foam was good. Although I am finding it difficult to actually cut. I think I will have to try a hot knife. The instructions were okay. Definitely could have been way better. Where is the CG on the model? According to my plans it is in front of the spar. But the bladder goes behind the spar. If this is true then it will be tail heavy when fuel is added, unless it is balanced with a full tank. Or with how close the bladder is to the CG it may have no effect on it.

Rolla

Edit: Also, do I need to round off wingtips? What is used to brace the wing near the TE?

I buy the cores from Phil and make my own fuse using a arrowshaft. This plane is Lil Hacker cores. I just cut lightening holes in the wing panels. I use a Contadina tomato paste can which is heated. You can see my bladder compartment. I now make them slightly wider. The compartment is done as follows. After the hole is cut you need to line the interior of the cutout with packing tape. This can be a pain in the neck but being careful and meticulous is important making sure each piece is overlapped. Anything sticking above and below the wing is slit and folded down. Smaller slits in the radius is necessary. Two layer of packing tape is placed on top and bottom of the cutout and then ironed down. At this point I make my hole for the bladder to enter and also a drain hole on the bottom of the wing. The wing is now covered. After all is done, I thin white glue with water and pour it into the compartment rolling the wing over and over. This will take a few days to dry but keep rolling it around and this will fuel proof the compartment and will assist the bladder when installing it into the compartment.Ken

Keep the Cg forward as this plane can get tail heavy. I trim the elevator a 1/4" at a time sometimes to replace some nose weight. I also like to keep the ply sides directly behind the firewall open. I do this by drilling a 1" hole in them as this will allow me to install some lead behind the firewall if needed.

Am I capable of lining the hole with epoxy and making a ring around with hole with epoxy? I was going to have the epoxy still somewhat tacky that way when I covered it the epoxy would really cling to it and prevent the fuel from coming between the two.

I wouldn't use epoxy as it would require quite a bit of it. I personally wouldn't use epoxy just due to the weight but that's me. The other reason is, if for some reasoning the epoxy dries and a sharp point is present, I can tell you first hand the bladder will find it. This recently happened to one of my wings when a small point of Gorilla glue and the bladder decided to meet and continuously broke 3 times in a row.

I wouldn't put anything around the hole where the bladder enters the wing either. Sometimes as bladders deplete during the run, they will spin in the compartment. I've had it turn so much it cut off the fuel supply. This isn't something that happens often but it does happen. I think it may be due to the set the bladder tubing has when it arrives in the coil. Leave nothing sharp that may puncture the bladder. Once the clear packing tape is placed over the hole on top and bottom and ironed, the seal is pretty much complete. If the bladder does break, and they do, your just trying to prevent fuel from seeping under the covering. In my picture, you can see how my compartment has a step in it. Don't replicate it. That happened when my son came down on top of me in a match and his prop went through my compartment ripping out the bladder and cutting a chunk of foam. That's just how I smoothed it up and recovered it. It's also the reason for it looking wrinkled as it's been recovered and sealed.

In the event you didn't want to use the wing, Phil does provide info on putting a tube through the engine nacelle. This would be an external bladder compartment housed in the plastic tube. Ken

I about have one ready to fly. Do these need tip weight?

Rolla

Rolla, I would certainly add some. I typically use about 5 grams. I usually bury it under the spar on the outboard wing.
A 1/4oz. square lead weight is approximately 7 grams. I cut a little off of it. In your case I would smash the weight flat. The end result is a paper thin sliver of lead about the size of a penny. I then make a slice in the end of the wing and insert with a little epoxy. I'm not sure of what type of line guide is provided in the kit. Phil usually has a laser cut piece of ply with 3-4 holes in it so that you can choose your specific location. When I run the lines, I place both lines through one hole. I found this to fly far superior then running one line through one hole and one line through another. It prevent the plane from yawing when going into the wingover and vertical maneuvers. Ken

Well, I have one finished. It has a Tee Dee .049 with an exhaust director to slow it down. Just waiting on a good day to try it. I may end up swapping in the Stels 049.

One good piece of advice I can offer to everyone. Always weigh your engines. As noted earlier in another post, they're are quite a bit of differences alone in Cox engines. Your going to find a difference in the Tee Dee and the Stels. I also am curious as to what Stels model you have. Stels made different models. Stels made 3 different type of twin horn exhaust, they also made a side exhaust (no name on case) with a true ABC piston sleeve. Prior to installing on your wing, I would check the balance and adj. If you could take a picture, it would certainly be neat to see. I'm a fan of Stels and truly enjoy mine. Ken

My first Hacker took quite a bit of weight to balance correctly. I am going to play with the CG on it to find a good spot. I had read that some of the Stels came as diesels and others had inserts. Mine is glow (has a high comp Cox head) and has no insert. By the looks of it it has to run on pressure. I think I will save the Stels for my second wing. The second one should be lighter and built better.









Edit: Forgot to add that I only paid $20 for it.