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VP Powermaster RC 30% nitro 9% Synthetic Castor Oil Empty VP Powermaster RC 30% nitro 9% Synthetic Castor Oil

Post  Iceberg Tue Oct 10, 2023 10:39 pm

Hi Friends
I just purchased a supply of VP racing fuel as listed in the title. Question I have is that fuel ok as it is for running in cox .049? I often add 10% Castor to synthetics. However does anyone know if this stuff is ok without adding Castor to it?

Thanks
Ice
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Post  Oldenginerod Wed Oct 11, 2023 4:40 am

You will definitely need to add more oil. 9% is not enough. As for castor/synth ratio, the jury is still out on that one. Some claim no problems with using all synth in Coxs. Others like to run at least half castor up to 25% total. Whatever the mix, I think you'll really need to have at least 20% oil. To be safe, most like to use at least 50% castor in their mix. Others like Ken Cook are happy to use majority synth fuel with no ill effects.
It would make it easier if we knew what the factory ratio of synth/castor was in commercial fuel, but they rarely give away their secrets.

Rod.
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Post  Ken Cook Wed Oct 11, 2023 3:32 pm

When I've used full synthetic, my oil content was 24%. In addition, for the nitro percentages I was using, castor oil wouldn't blend with the fuel. It literally laid on top of it . It reminded me when my wife makes salad dressing. I'm a big fan of Powermaster fuels.
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Post  Levent Suberk Wed Oct 11, 2023 3:37 pm

Hi Ken, what percentage of nitro you use?
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Post  Iceberg Wed Oct 11, 2023 7:19 pm

Thanks olenginerod
I will top up another 11% Castor to hit the 20% mark.

Thanks
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Post  Oldenginerod Wed Oct 11, 2023 7:52 pm

Iceberg wrote:Thanks olenginerod
I will top up another 11% Castor to hit the 20% mark.

Thanks
Ice

That's what I would do!! Thumbs Up
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Post  Ken Cook Thu Oct 12, 2023 4:02 am

I used 45% nitro to 65%. Nowadays due to the cost of nitro, I keep it around 30%. It was around 40% when I started to notice the oil not wanting to mix. Some suggested to me to add acetone to help with insuring the oil mixes with the fuel. I never tried this. When I would pour in Klotz synthetic or even the 20% castor /synthetic mix it would instantly blend.
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Post  ffkiwi Fri Oct 13, 2023 2:11 pm

Ken Cook wrote:I used 45% nitro to 65%. Nowadays due to the cost of nitro, I keep it around 30%. It was around 40% when I started to notice the oil not wanting to mix. Some suggested to me to add acetone to help with insuring the oil mixes with the fuel. I never tried this. When I would pour in Klotz synthetic or even the 20% castor /synthetic mix it would instantly blend.

This makes sense-the critical % of nitro is around 45%-when it comes to castor mixing...and that will be slightly influenced by methanol purity, temperature and other factors....including whether the castor is 'straight' or has had some post extraction chemical modification. As Ken notes-a small amount of acetone added...[from my own experiments as little as 2% v/v] can solve your miscibility problems.

I used to use 50% nitro in my Payload models....and these were only flown at our Nats....so once a year. It was fairly normal to find -during Nats preparation...that the fuel had separated into two layers on standing unused for months. A bit of careful sequential addition of acetone and vigorous shaking followed by some settling time sorted it out. I did add it sequentially a few mls at a time to minimise the dilution of the nitro %...obviously there's no point in adding 5% acetone if 2% does the trick.

I don't know if anyone has done the systematic test of mix ratios of synthetic:castor in Coxes; I am aware of one past study involving all synthetic [I think it was posted on the 049 Collectors forum when that still existed] where the poster claimed no problem encountered with running full synthetics.....most of us I suspect would be happier with some castor in the mix....but I'm unaware of any hard data on say 5%, 10% 20% 50% etc
-though I imagine Cox themselves probably did some work in this area when synthetics first became an option in the mid to late 60s

You would need a lot of work-and very good equipment-to come up with any repeatable systematic measurements; not to mention how you go about defining 'acceptable wear' for the purposes of overall assessment of the effectiveness of the lubricant component of the fuel

ChrisM
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